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Zitat jhdf51:
So anybody..if we end up in Collyer's court how long from there is this going to take?
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Zitat footballref-8541:
It doesn't matter, if we end up in Collyers court, the rise in the k & p's will be so great, you'll be able to wait.
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Zitat Bizreader:
Very good point: large investors will push up our stock price if Washington Mutual, Inc. get's to press it's point with Susman and our Equity Committee in charge in Washington D.C.. our price per share will reflect large investors betting in favor of equity, imo.
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Zitat jhdf51:
Man Biz..it has been a long time coming. I hope this month is the month.
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Zitat Bizreader:
I hope too but at this point I don't expect it to be done this month.
I just don't feel it. My sense is that too many lawyers are making too much money on this cash cow project.
This is not to say that the EC is intentionally dragging this out, and I certainly don't think WMI and Rosen are now interested in seeing it go longer, but the FDIC and JP Morgan have no interest in seeing it done and in the mean time there seems to be lots more legal meanderings to be explored before all is said and done.
For example, even after our BK judge gives her opinion, which is AFTER written and oral, (by the way, when are orals again?), her opinion is not the final word due to the Stern case and the ANICO/ Collyer option recently opened.
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Zitat Large Green:
Aug.24th is the verbal end to the Confirmation Hearings.
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Zitat MONICALAW:
Does it mean that Judge Collyer will take over authomatically? or this useless creepy Judge will keep her Controlling Game of Cat and Mouse for another year or so??????TIA LG, I value your opinion very much....MML
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Zitat Large Green:
Unless a settlement by the Horsies to prevent a potential devastating opinion by this Judge, or some other sort of deal with Susman involving others she will have to deny in order to keep control. I believe you are correct in that this Judge will make sure she keeps control by denying this plan. We do not care how we get it denied or this Judges ulterior motives, just as long as the plan is denied.
I think our savings grace is that she does NOT want to lose control, otherwise I have no doubts she would be approving this POR and of course now we have ANICO and Stern to prevent her from approving. Her next best action is to deny in order to esnure some sort of settlement before losing total control of this crime ridden saga!
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Zitat MONICALAW:
Agreed LG, you are very correct in this mostly because if she doesn't control all these, then she will have to deal with Supreme Justice Court, or DOJ.....Down the line.....Am I correct? or Far from relevance????
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Zitat fsshon:
Look it is as simple as this.. If the GSA is ruled to have been negotiated in bad faith or better yet, the BK court rules it does not have the jurisdiction to release or settle the Preference and Fraudualent transfer claims (in GSA) still pending (stayed) in DC, then the BK court will have to by new law (Stern) stay the BK and let the case go back to Collyer, who will have to lift the stay and adjudicate these claims in a Federal Court..
Stern is a saving grace for us.. Thank You Anna Nicole!
~Don~
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Zitat Large Green:
fsshon, your take on these chapter 11 cases being stayed due to jurisdictional issues are very real and we will see how much this case has to do about control in Walrath's court which I think is EVERYTHING and here is why.
You have tried to tell me Walrath did not zero equity out in her opinion on 1/7/2011 and I have to differ. I understand she let equity have a shot at the NOL's via insider trading allegations from Thoma that she could have easily ignored. Yes, I will agree with this, but this Judge gave our ENTIRE ESTATE away to her criminal allie JPM whom she is/has been aiding/protecting, leaving us with maybe the NOL's and the new company. How can anyone say this is even remotely correct or in fact legal. I bet ANY jury would cite this Judge with aiding and abetting multiple crimes if given a chance and I know, unfortunately that will never happen. I have no doubt this Judge will nail to some degree, these Hedgies, as this was her agenga and nobody else's except Thoma, whom she could have ignored very easily. She has proven this with Ilene, whom she ignored with the Boli/Coli issue that Rosie lied in open court about.
Walrath has PROVEN to me through her actions that she is aiding/protecting JPM and if you think she is going to give up control, I think you are dreaming. The very fortunate happening to equity are ANICO/STERN and these other court rulings to nuter Walrath from approving this POR. The next best action for her to keep control and AMAZINGLY a huge turnabout and completely uexpected action, considering her frame of mind during her last opinion on 1/7/2011 is to keep control for a settlement, she has to deny the plan. This is quite shocking in that her denial will be to ensure a settlement, thus protecting JPM to the extent she can in HER COURT before moving the case forward.
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Zitat MONICALAW:
JMW, is on JPM/FDIC side while she is throwing a few bones towards EC, in pretence she is a good Judge......However, we read her hands and she will be in turn on trial for her underhanded work......IMVHO
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Zitat Desperado90:
Large, you are not looking at the issue from the right perspective.
In root cause Analysis, you have to identify the root cause of a problem or event.
The Debtorsare the problem here. Who agrees to give the adversary even more assets after they got the bank for almost free. WMI didn't not even receive the $1.9B paid by JPM for the bank.
Put the blame where its supposed to go and we should stop all this attacks on the Judge.
The Debtors are our problem, they even gave the BOLI/COLI Assets away for nothing instead of at least agreeing to a split. Wind Farms and Visa shares were given away by the debtors.
To add insult to injury, they gave more of the Tax refunds to JPig and you think the judge is the problem.
The Judge is the least of our problem, we need to get ready to sue the debtors and their professionals.
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Zitat Large Green:
desperado, the Judge in her opinion that said was fair and reasonable gave away all of our claims, the entire estate with maybe the exception of NOL's and Newcom. If she signs a POR even closely resembling this, your stock is cancelled with no hope of ANY recovery. Now, before you say she is not to blame, wow my friend you better look again and realize where this case is and what is at stake with this Judge's signature!
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Zitat fsshon:
Look MML and LG.. Put yourself in the Judge's shoes, how would you have ruled in the following circumstances... read the Opinion first before you jump on me for this scenario..
1. Debtors have asked the court to let them settle the claims and causes of action that the court has jurisdiction over (FDCI-R and Chase)..
2. Creditors approve of and helped negotiate the settlement that discards the claims by FDIC and JPMC accordingly totaling 57B.
3. Court is only concerned with creditors in BK, but will concern itself with equity (appoint a committee) if it finds their may be value for them and they need adequate legal representation.
4. Court looks at terms of settlement (that is agreeable between all parties but equity) and decides it is the best solution for all parties except equity.. However, court keeps Equity in the case by allowing it to have say in the value of its NOL's.. Knowing full weel those NOL's are one of the debtors largest assets in BK.. So Court keeps equity in case..
5. Court decides the GSA is F&R, because it settles the claims the debtors agree to settle, the money is divided accordingly and the court believes the GSA has been negotiated in Good Faith..
6. Court learns at 2nd confirmation hearing that the SNH's negotiated the GSA without the debtors input.. UH-OH! There goes Good faith, Court learns the SNH's traded on the term sheet info while negotiating.. UH-OH there goes SNH's claims. Court is now well aware of what happened.. Court knows this GSA will not stand on appeal, it is now subject to Stern, which now per the Supreme Court has the preference and Fraudulent transfer clains needing to be adjudicated in Collyers court, not Walraths, that means these claims can not legally be released by the BK court, which means the debtors can only settle them in DC, not Delaware..
Get it? Now what would you as a Judge faced with what you knew Pre-Confirmation Dec have done.. She told the debtors they were walking a fine line, she allowed a hearsay shareholder a voice in the opinion...
What would you have done,, before you convict THJMW think about what you would have done.. Read the Opinion, there are points she makes that are now no longer true and she and clerks know this now, they were lied to and snowed, this Judge should be PO'ed in chambers, but must be professional in court !!!!
Wait, Learn and Watch.. You guys will give this Judge back her TH in time, The LIBR will disappear by Oct !!! Wake up, go read the Opinion, this Judge writes what she knew about, guess whatm, she knows so much more now!
~Don~
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Zitat Large Green:
fsshon, as always very good points and I will be the first one (hopefully so) to stand up and give this Judge her TOTAL title back and trust me, that is exactly what I want to do!
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Zitat MONICALAW:
Don, I only hope you are right and we are wrong......However, look at the mankind by what he does , and not by what he sais.......and JMW will get her TH back for us when she does the fair Judgement.....That is all.....and until then she is just a JMW in my book.....MML
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