www.boardpost.net/forum/...hp?topic=11500.msg190420#msg190420
Zitat Mr_Simpson:
Quote from: kenwalker on Today at 10:37:37 AM
45 days?
Ken: August 11th is in 2 days... what is this about ? to identify what you are going sell as your relinquished property
-------------------------------
Zitat kenwalker:
Yep. Will we hear anything and if so, when?
.......... be in writing, signed by you and delivered to a person involved in the exchange like the seller of the replacement property or the qualified intermediary
As a public company maybe the 2nd qtr or it could be a 10K later but you would think retail would need to be notified. Or they could just piss away a half mil.
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Zitat kenwalker auf Post von User myplace :
(Quote from: myplace on Today at 12:44:52 PM
Are 1031's good for exchanging business or just RE ?)
Zitat kenwalker:
To qualify for Section 1031 of the Internal Revenue Code, the properties exchanged must be held for productive use in a trade or business, or for investment. Stocks, bonds, and other properties are listed as expressly excluded by Section 1031 of the Internal Revenue Code, although securitized properties are not excluded. The properties exchanged must be of "like kind", i.e., of the same nature or character, even if they differ in grade or quality.
Look, I don't know what the heck they are up to but they are up to something, 187 days when it's a 180 day rule? So, yes IMHO they are up to something and it's about damn time. We are all trying to follow along in working this puzzle out, problem is "our" puzzle has the pieces of about a dozen other puzzle mixed in, the picture of the final product is unknown and they turned off the lights. I think if half of what has been speculate is correct ................ we've done good.
------------------------------
Zitat Uncle_Bo:
Securitization is the process of taking an illiquid asset, or group of assets, and through financial engineering, transforming them into a security. ... First, a regulated and authorized financial institution originates numerous mortgages, which are secured by claims against the various properties the mortgagors purchase.
And...WMIH owns 100% of the equity interest in WMIIC
Quote
An equitable interest is an "interest held by virtue of an equitable title (a title that indicates a beneficial interest in property and that gives the holder the right to acquire formal legal title) or claimed on equitable grounds, such as the interest held by a trust beneficiary."
------------------------------
Zitat Uncle_Bo:
Quote
azcowboy
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Re: Understanding WMIIC and the WMI-LT connection
« Reply #200 on: February 03, 2016, 09:01:55 AM »
Quote
... THIS ... is all about money and greed' ... Pure and simple' ...
With the open trading of the WMIH stock obviously being manipulated daily from the ~ "2012' Plan's Implementation" ... to the constant internet message boards attempt to diminish the value of the WMI Original Debtors Estate' ... again, ... Currently owned by the releasing legacy shareholders' ... This is and always has been about money and greed' and the attempt to screw as many of the original retail people as possible' ... as I described in my reply # 165 of this same thread, the anger runs deep, and greed has no boundary's ...
The WMI-LT, is the distribution vehicle, designated and registered as a ... A Grantors Trust=A Pass Through Trust ... that will eventually be utilized to distribute returning value for estate ownership' ... distribute to the Owners of the WMI Original "debtors and debtors in possession" via a #1) cash or a #4) common shares in the newly reorganized company ...
WE' (the releasing equity legacy owners) ... Own' the "asset value" of the Original WMI Estate, ... while WMIH owns the "equity value" of the same' ... Due to this Plan Approved Connection between these TWO' ... The LT can not entertain outside bidders ? ... and ... the new company can not go anywhere without addressing two distinct issues ... 1) the asset value of its own sub WMIIC ? ... and ... 2) the intercompany claims' ...
WMIH-Corp still only show roughly 206m shares out with the availability to issue up to 3.5 billion' ... WMIH-Corp is currently cash poor ... to utilize the financing agreements cash ? it must entertain, a debt / dilution instrument
A legacy shareholder that released as instructed, holds markers and shares in the newco' ... BOTH are extremely valuable' as the WMI Estate was obviously massive' ... tracking markers, can not be obtained, however shares in the newco can be'
with only 206m shares out, the shares in WMIH-Corp are valuable ... remember, ONLY Tranche 6 participants - class 19 & class 22 received markers' ... and remain, the TRUE Owners of the Original WMI Estate' ... no one else' ... again' ... NO ONE ELSE
AZ
Reply # 165;
Quote
azcowboy on February 02, 2016, 05:31:59 PM
Because, to this group of a few naysayers' ? ... the TRUTH, of what actually happened' is not what is actually important ... Mike W's ownership of class 22 uq's and his success has a few people simply loosing ... it' ... however ? like ol' AZ says ? ... doesn't matter ...
while scouring over numerous documents, I read quite a few of the late Dec 2011' early Jan 2012 letters submitted to the court DISPUTING and people being quite UPSET' over the mediated result' and what was to soon become, the Plan 7 approval ... yes, individuals, many familiar names' ... one right after another ... many, were very much against the Plan 7 approval'
... many ... never once considered that the lowly' common shareholders (class 22 uq's) would be ? or, ever should have ever been, a remote consideration' ... thus, the numerous large individual plays on class 16's and class 21's ... class 21 being also equity designated, but still above a uq' ... hmmmm'
everyone knows ... there has been, lots and lots of very deep inset' anger, ... initially and obviously against Mike W, ... then, as Plan 6 was denied ?, rubbing the hedge funds nose in the public poop' ? ... then as the mediated result was ordered ?, ... the capping of the 16's ? ... the placing of the 21's in a class 12 final consideration ? ... the removal of absolute priority ? ... and ... the absolute icing on the cake' ... the inclusion of the lowly common shareholder ... a class 22 uq's ... with equal status' and simultaneous payment' ... 75% / 25% ... many, were so upset that they were blowing a proverbial' gasket' ...
One of The ... TWO ... cherrys on top, was the recent reveal of footnote # 1 & footnote # 2, ... showing how the Court had defined the last creditor class to be impaired from the very onset' of the Plans Implementation ... and, that people like a "general unsecured claimant", ... or ... us (equity) would never be issued an LTI' or obviously a runoff note' ... I posted and posted about this ... and not once' ... NOT ONCE, was I asked by anyone' ... to produce the document that held these very important footnotes' ... as always, the personal attacks take precedence over the actual information' ...
Secondly ? ... is the reveal of the documented connection between the new company WMIH-Corp and the WMI Liquidating Trust, ... as the releasing legacy shareholders own the WMI assets held within WMIIC, while the new company owns the "equity value" of the same' ... and ... neither can move forward without the other' ...
So, as the Court determined, ... a class 16 would never, legally or mathematically ever be able to achieve "face amount (value)" ... only a base value cap at $10.52 plus FJR interest paid as long as the case remained open ... remember' ... the Trust states that an LTI goes away when the Trust' finalizes' ... NOT A MARKER HOLDER' ... everyone thought that we' would be issued an LTI' ... however, again ... we (equity) will never be issued an LTI' ...
that' along with ... again' the Disclosure Statement's Exhibit C defining the distribution methods allowed' ... honestly, I believe has a few of these internet message board posters, ... a bit nuts ... over making whatever poor decisions that they made' ? ... and that Mike W was quite successful' in securing the future of equity' ... Mike did good' ... but in doing so, ... made a lot of participants, other than equity owners, ... quite angry' ...
Again, under a normal circumstance ? ... a class 16 should have been a good and secure buy with a reasonable $789m / 23 m share (roughly $35.00) at a purchase price under say $10.00 ... and ... a class 19 should have been capped at face plus interest (now, all classes have been limited to FJR - ON THE CLAIM -) and a class 21 should be above a class 22 in the greater realm of all things considered, ... But' ... But ... But ... This wasn't anywhere near a normal Bankruptcy Case' now was it ? ... right ?
Nope' ... This was TWO Bankruptcy cases' ... filed by some very, very, very, smart people ~ with a plan to secure WMI's value ~ after the seizure of a solvent bank' ... and' ... had the bank NOT BEEN SOLVENT ? the FDIC could NOT be running around bragging about how this didn't cost them ... one thin dime' ... Nope ... This was a special case' ... This is WaMu' ... and ... as Geitner said ... there ain't gonna be any more ~ WaMu's
just sayin'
AZ :)
--------------------------------------------------
Zitatende
MfG.L:)
Zitat Mr_Simpson:
Quote from: kenwalker on Today at 10:37:37 AM
45 days?
Ken: August 11th is in 2 days... what is this about ? to identify what you are going sell as your relinquished property
-------------------------------
Zitat kenwalker:
Yep. Will we hear anything and if so, when?
.......... be in writing, signed by you and delivered to a person involved in the exchange like the seller of the replacement property or the qualified intermediary
As a public company maybe the 2nd qtr or it could be a 10K later but you would think retail would need to be notified. Or they could just piss away a half mil.
-----------------------------
Zitat kenwalker auf Post von User myplace :
(Quote from: myplace on Today at 12:44:52 PM
Are 1031's good for exchanging business or just RE ?)
Zitat kenwalker:
To qualify for Section 1031 of the Internal Revenue Code, the properties exchanged must be held for productive use in a trade or business, or for investment. Stocks, bonds, and other properties are listed as expressly excluded by Section 1031 of the Internal Revenue Code, although securitized properties are not excluded. The properties exchanged must be of "like kind", i.e., of the same nature or character, even if they differ in grade or quality.
Look, I don't know what the heck they are up to but they are up to something, 187 days when it's a 180 day rule? So, yes IMHO they are up to something and it's about damn time. We are all trying to follow along in working this puzzle out, problem is "our" puzzle has the pieces of about a dozen other puzzle mixed in, the picture of the final product is unknown and they turned off the lights. I think if half of what has been speculate is correct ................ we've done good.
------------------------------
Zitat Uncle_Bo:
Securitization is the process of taking an illiquid asset, or group of assets, and through financial engineering, transforming them into a security. ... First, a regulated and authorized financial institution originates numerous mortgages, which are secured by claims against the various properties the mortgagors purchase.
And...WMIH owns 100% of the equity interest in WMIIC
Quote
An equitable interest is an "interest held by virtue of an equitable title (a title that indicates a beneficial interest in property and that gives the holder the right to acquire formal legal title) or claimed on equitable grounds, such as the interest held by a trust beneficiary."
------------------------------
Zitat Uncle_Bo:
Quote
azcowboy
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 3493
1 ID No Aliases BP, GB, and Yahoo
View Profile Personal Message Quote Personal Message (Offline)
Re: Understanding WMIIC and the WMI-LT connection
« Reply #200 on: February 03, 2016, 09:01:55 AM »
Quote
... THIS ... is all about money and greed' ... Pure and simple' ...
With the open trading of the WMIH stock obviously being manipulated daily from the ~ "2012' Plan's Implementation" ... to the constant internet message boards attempt to diminish the value of the WMI Original Debtors Estate' ... again, ... Currently owned by the releasing legacy shareholders' ... This is and always has been about money and greed' and the attempt to screw as many of the original retail people as possible' ... as I described in my reply # 165 of this same thread, the anger runs deep, and greed has no boundary's ...
The WMI-LT, is the distribution vehicle, designated and registered as a ... A Grantors Trust=A Pass Through Trust ... that will eventually be utilized to distribute returning value for estate ownership' ... distribute to the Owners of the WMI Original "debtors and debtors in possession" via a #1) cash or a #4) common shares in the newly reorganized company ...
WE' (the releasing equity legacy owners) ... Own' the "asset value" of the Original WMI Estate, ... while WMIH owns the "equity value" of the same' ... Due to this Plan Approved Connection between these TWO' ... The LT can not entertain outside bidders ? ... and ... the new company can not go anywhere without addressing two distinct issues ... 1) the asset value of its own sub WMIIC ? ... and ... 2) the intercompany claims' ...
WMIH-Corp still only show roughly 206m shares out with the availability to issue up to 3.5 billion' ... WMIH-Corp is currently cash poor ... to utilize the financing agreements cash ? it must entertain, a debt / dilution instrument
A legacy shareholder that released as instructed, holds markers and shares in the newco' ... BOTH are extremely valuable' as the WMI Estate was obviously massive' ... tracking markers, can not be obtained, however shares in the newco can be'
with only 206m shares out, the shares in WMIH-Corp are valuable ... remember, ONLY Tranche 6 participants - class 19 & class 22 received markers' ... and remain, the TRUE Owners of the Original WMI Estate' ... no one else' ... again' ... NO ONE ELSE
AZ
Reply # 165;
Quote
azcowboy on February 02, 2016, 05:31:59 PM
Because, to this group of a few naysayers' ? ... the TRUTH, of what actually happened' is not what is actually important ... Mike W's ownership of class 22 uq's and his success has a few people simply loosing ... it' ... however ? like ol' AZ says ? ... doesn't matter ...
while scouring over numerous documents, I read quite a few of the late Dec 2011' early Jan 2012 letters submitted to the court DISPUTING and people being quite UPSET' over the mediated result' and what was to soon become, the Plan 7 approval ... yes, individuals, many familiar names' ... one right after another ... many, were very much against the Plan 7 approval'
... many ... never once considered that the lowly' common shareholders (class 22 uq's) would be ? or, ever should have ever been, a remote consideration' ... thus, the numerous large individual plays on class 16's and class 21's ... class 21 being also equity designated, but still above a uq' ... hmmmm'
everyone knows ... there has been, lots and lots of very deep inset' anger, ... initially and obviously against Mike W, ... then, as Plan 6 was denied ?, rubbing the hedge funds nose in the public poop' ? ... then as the mediated result was ordered ?, ... the capping of the 16's ? ... the placing of the 21's in a class 12 final consideration ? ... the removal of absolute priority ? ... and ... the absolute icing on the cake' ... the inclusion of the lowly common shareholder ... a class 22 uq's ... with equal status' and simultaneous payment' ... 75% / 25% ... many, were so upset that they were blowing a proverbial' gasket' ...
One of The ... TWO ... cherrys on top, was the recent reveal of footnote # 1 & footnote # 2, ... showing how the Court had defined the last creditor class to be impaired from the very onset' of the Plans Implementation ... and, that people like a "general unsecured claimant", ... or ... us (equity) would never be issued an LTI' or obviously a runoff note' ... I posted and posted about this ... and not once' ... NOT ONCE, was I asked by anyone' ... to produce the document that held these very important footnotes' ... as always, the personal attacks take precedence over the actual information' ...
Secondly ? ... is the reveal of the documented connection between the new company WMIH-Corp and the WMI Liquidating Trust, ... as the releasing legacy shareholders own the WMI assets held within WMIIC, while the new company owns the "equity value" of the same' ... and ... neither can move forward without the other' ...
So, as the Court determined, ... a class 16 would never, legally or mathematically ever be able to achieve "face amount (value)" ... only a base value cap at $10.52 plus FJR interest paid as long as the case remained open ... remember' ... the Trust states that an LTI goes away when the Trust' finalizes' ... NOT A MARKER HOLDER' ... everyone thought that we' would be issued an LTI' ... however, again ... we (equity) will never be issued an LTI' ...
that' along with ... again' the Disclosure Statement's Exhibit C defining the distribution methods allowed' ... honestly, I believe has a few of these internet message board posters, ... a bit nuts ... over making whatever poor decisions that they made' ? ... and that Mike W was quite successful' in securing the future of equity' ... Mike did good' ... but in doing so, ... made a lot of participants, other than equity owners, ... quite angry' ...
Again, under a normal circumstance ? ... a class 16 should have been a good and secure buy with a reasonable $789m / 23 m share (roughly $35.00) at a purchase price under say $10.00 ... and ... a class 19 should have been capped at face plus interest (now, all classes have been limited to FJR - ON THE CLAIM -) and a class 21 should be above a class 22 in the greater realm of all things considered, ... But' ... But ... But ... This wasn't anywhere near a normal Bankruptcy Case' now was it ? ... right ?
Nope' ... This was TWO Bankruptcy cases' ... filed by some very, very, very, smart people ~ with a plan to secure WMI's value ~ after the seizure of a solvent bank' ... and' ... had the bank NOT BEEN SOLVENT ? the FDIC could NOT be running around bragging about how this didn't cost them ... one thin dime' ... Nope ... This was a special case' ... This is WaMu' ... and ... as Geitner said ... there ain't gonna be any more ~ WaMu's
just sayin'
AZ :)
--------------------------------------------------
Zitatende
MfG.L:)
Alles nur meine pers. Meinung, kein Kauf- oder Verkaufs-Empfehlung!